Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis"

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HotFoot
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Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis"

#1

Post by HotFoot »

I suppose most any technical repair procedure can be accomplished if enough money is thrown at it and the appropriately skilled and tooled are tasked to perform it. (I'll bet Jay Leno would come up with all the 4Cyl GWing bearings he might ever need) Anyway....

The shortage of conrod and main crank bearings: Would it be feasible to have worn out shells reconditioned? .... custom replated with the copper, nickel?, and lead/babbit? Of course, providing that the steel base is sound.

Just wondering.

Hoppy
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#2

Post by SnoBrdr »

HotFoot wrote:I suppose most any technical repair procedure can be accomplished if enough money is thrown at it and the appropriately skilled and tooled are tasked to perform it. (I'll bet Jay Leno would come up with all the 4Cyl GWing bearings he might ever need) Anyway....

The shortage of conrod and main crank bearings: Would it be feasible to have worn out shells reconditioned? .... custom replated with the copper, nickel?, and lead/babbit? Of course, providing that the steel base is sound.

Just wondering.

Hoppy
Gimme a blank check and I can probably get anything done/fixed.

But would it be feasible, probably not.
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#3

Post by CYBORG »

There are companies who will make new ones for you. But there is a setup charge, and a minimum order of a thousand. And ofcourse, thats for each color
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#4

Post by HotFoot »

CYBORG wrote:There are companies who will make new ones for you. But there is a setup charge, and a minimum order of a thousand. And ofcourse, thats for each color
Hmmm... ok... six different colors of each for the rods, let's say 6000, double for the oil hole (drilled and undrilled), there's 12000.

The mains, five colors, 5000 quant there. We are up to 17000 units. Maybe they can be made for (wild guess) $5.00 each material cost, add set up charges for 11 different units, bargain day at $5000. Innovation and Imagination Tax of $1000. So far $91000. Let's be safe and add a fudge factor and round it off to $100,000. :shock: Well...not today, just looked at my checking acct balance. But, going into town in a few hours for errands. Maybe I'll stop by the bank and see if they can help out. Probably not though.

Bummer,
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#5

Post by SnoBrdr »

CYBORG wrote:There are companies who will make new ones for you. But there is a setup charge, and a minimum order of a thousand. And ofcourse, thats for each color
Ya it's too bad that when Honda decided to pull support for the GL 1000 series that they probably had all the tooling destroyed along with a few warehouses full of other parts.
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#6

Post by JSBail »

SnoBrdr wrote:
CYBORG wrote:There are companies who will make new ones for you. But there is a setup charge, and a minimum order of a thousand. And ofcourse, thats for each color
Ya it's too bad that when Honda decided to pull support for the GL 1000 series that they probably had all the tooling destroyed along with a few warehouses full of other parts.
And it's getting worse. I'm not sure about the 750's but I know that rod and main bearings for the cb500/cb550-4's are no more. My youngest son for a while had an 80 sumtin first gen v-4 vf500 interceptor and that bike was near impossible to find parts for, it was easier finding parts for his older bros 72 cb350 twin.
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#7

Post by joedrum »

there only one reason this is done ...and its obvious
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#8

Post by SnoBrdr »

joedrum wrote:there only one reason this is done ...and its obvious
Other than wanting you to buy a new model I can't think of one.
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#9

Post by gregforesi »

Bingo. First try too!
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#10

Post by Bugdaddy66 »

The other reason parts disappear after while is that they are many times supplied by an outside subcontractor. Once the manufacture stops ordering the parts for new vehicles, they have no incentive to keep making them unless the aftermarket/repair world is selling them in sufficient numbers to justify it. Our beloved GL1000 engine was produced in a fairly limited number, for a fairly short time period when you compare it to something like a Harley V twin which has great aftermarket support. I play with Yamaha 650 twins and 500 singles also, many parts are available in the aftermarket due to the long production life of these bikes. That's what we get for owning a bike that goes 30+ years and 100,000+ miles before needing repair!
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#11

Post by joedrum »

thats a lame excuse not to honor there product ... and it is certainly no excuse to be considered the last person they want in there dealerships .....
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#12

Post by JSBail »

A big problem is that it's hard for the aftermarket to have the incentive when companies like Honda are always evolving their engines so much so that there is little in common with previous engines. My 77 cb750's engine for the most part remained unchanged since the day it was introduced in 69, some subtle changes here and there but still interchangeable between years. My sons vf500 on the other hand was a first gen v-4 that was only out for 3 or 4 years and then a new design/generation v-4 appeared and all changes made do not allow parts to be interchangeable from one gen to the next, basically when a next gen of engine appears the previous gen quickly becomes obsolete and unless a whole bunch were sold and those owners are still spending the money to repair them then the aftermarket will walk away too and focus on the next gen engines. What makes the cb750 such a survivor is that so many were sold in the first place and are gaining popularity again with the vintage bike crowd so a lot of parts (not all) are still available even from Honda. In a way it's good to see companies like Honda always trying to stay on top of new technologies but that moving forward attitude sometimes makes it hard to look back. In comparison how often has HD come up with a new design compared to Honda?
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#13

Post by Bugdaddy66 »

I don't feel its not honoring their product, that there are any parts available on a 30+ year old product is amazing, I have to deal with many 10 year old vehicles that are next to impossible to get parts for. Like most manufactures, they probably estimated the amount of parts needed to take care of their customers (original purchasers) for the foreseeable lifetime of the product. To supply all possible parts for all subsequent owners and restorers indefinitely would be impossible.
I may be biased in this opinion in that I get confronted with this problem daily because I don't have parts available for every year and model of Ford ever built (I work in a dealership). With about 50,000 new part numbers every year, about 5 years is average for every single part to still be available for a given model.
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#14

Post by scootsx2 »

joedrum wrote:thats a lame excuse not to honor there product ... and it is certainly no excuse to be considered the last person they want in there dealerships .....
No, it's not a lame excuse. We have not been victimized by Honda.

I work for a computer systems manufacturer and the situation is basically the same. All machines share two characteristics: EOL (End of Life) and EOS (End of Support). EOL is essentially when the machine is no longer manufactured and sold new. EOS, which comes some number of years after EOL, is when parts and other support are no longer available. Its not a matter of trying to coerce customers into buying new machines. It a matter of economics. A manufacturer or parts supplier can not be expected to continue to have parts available for an indefinite time. Its economically unfeasible. In many companies, when EOL approaches, the supply chain people usually make a one-time last purchase of parts from their suppliers in order to support the installed machine base until EOS. At my company, by policy EOS is somewhere from 3 - 5 years after EOL however, as a practical matter, we frequently still have some parts as well as product knowledge available well after the EOS date.
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Re: Musings on "The Great 4Cyl GWing Bearing Shortage Crisis

#15

Post by joedrum »

well thats your opinion ...and i gave mine ...your opinion with all the words of support is still an opinion ..i never said honda was any different than others that do the same thing .. in some fields it make stuff that cost lots of money worthless instantly ....to me that a screw job from the big to the little ...if ok with you fine its not for me ...i see on the forums every day people will to spend money for parts ...again it really lame excuse and lack of product support and turning a great motor like oldwings into junk period in my book ...and no excuse to dealer policies towards people with older bikes they will fix up after trade and sale them after they take it in on trade when they refuse to fix them ...your argument just dosnt hold water to me
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