My very first 1977 Honda GL1000 =D

[desertrefugee]

I think maybe your California "sea rust" works more from the outside in rather than the Eastern inside out rust. So, I'm not surprised that the frame member probably just sports heavy surface rust. Just make sure the metal has not been compromised. There or anywhere.

[aaronrecine]

I think maybe your California "sea rust" works more from the outside in rather than the Eastern inside out rust. So, I'm not surprised that the frame member probably just sports heavy surface rust. Just make sure the metal has not been compromised. There or anywhere.

Absolutely. Everything seems okay so far

[aaronrecine]

Greetings and happy Monday!

I decided before committing to a select paint for the entire frame I would pick a few hidden areas to try out.

For the non rusted test area I decided on one of the frame sections that run behind the top housing. I decided to go with Dupli-color engine enamel for my frame paint as my friend highly recommended it.

For the rusted test area I decided on the left rear tail section where the rear fender and seat attach. I bought Permatex's Rust Treatment Spray based on reviews on amazon. It is basically a rust converter which turns the rust into iron from what I understand. It needs 24 hours to cure, but I decided i'd try it out on one small section, and if it looked any better at all after 5 hours I would coat the whole frame in it to stop all the rust.

Before painting I scraped all the heavy rust away with steel brushes, used rags and Chemtool to remove any heavy oil and grease deposits, then followed with a microfiber towel and acetone.

For the Dupli-color section I sanded the old paint with some 220 until it smoothed out well enough for a primer coat. I cleaned the section with acetone again, then applied 2 light coats followed by one heavy wet coat of Dupli-color Engine Enamel Primer then another 2 light coats followed by one heavy wet coat of Dupli-color DE1635 Semi Gloss Engine Enamel with Ceramic. I didn't sand between any of the coats. 10 minute cure intervals between coats and no more than an hour of curing time for the primer before laying down the color enamel.

I let the final coat sit for an hour and proceeded to place a lamp over the paint to cure it. I am very happy with the results I got with so little effort.

The permatex yielded decent results, so I proceeded to coat the entire frame in it.

I'm going to let it cure over a week, then I will sand everything smooth, tape everything off, prep with acetone then lay down the paint, wet sand, etc.

I labeled some of the pictures below to identify the before and after pictures Enjoy!

Barely laid down the first coat of permatex in the picture below


This just after the 2nd coat just under 2 minutes after the first coat per Permatex instructions


This is just after coating the entire frame after the first 2 coats sat for 5 hours

[robin1731]

Hate to sound like a broken record but that center stand looks like it is rather far forward. One of the signs of the frame section being rusted is the center stand going way past where it should when it's down. Maybe someone else can confirm or deny? Just looks a bit too far in the pic.

.

[desertrefugee]

Excellent work. I've done some serious rust repair of cars (Austin Healy and MG - which came from the factory with rust, I think), but never a bike with that much. I have also used the rust converters, but do not trust them implicitly. I am not a fan of covering known rust, converted or not. I am sure that your work will endure for years, but will the rust ever take hold again? I always tried to wire wheel and/or grind away as much as possible before treatment. The wirebrush method doesn't get it all. Again, maybe it doesn't have to.

Either way, great work on restoring a machine most would give up for dead! If you're having fun restoring it, imagine what riding it will be like!

[aaronrecine]

Hate to sound like a broken record but that center stand looks like it is rather far forward. One of the signs of the frame section being rusted is the center stand going way past where it should when it's down. Maybe someone else can confirm or deny? Just looks a bit too far in the pic.

.

I believe it maybe an optical illusion due to the lack of the engine. The forks are fully unloaded instead of having the pre-load of the engine and everything. I found the article in shoptalk identifying where cracks can occur and how the center stand can bend forward. I didn't see any cracks, but will double check again tomorrow. Thanks for pointing it out and I'd love to hear others assessment.

[aaronrecine]

Excellent work. I've done some serious rust repair of cars (Austin Healy and MG - which came from the factory with rust, I think), but never a bike with that much. I have also used the rust converters, but do not trust them implicitly. I am not a fan of covering known rust, converted or not. I am sure that your work will endure for years, but will the rust ever take hold again? I always tried to wire wheel and/or grind away as much as possible before treatment. The wirebrush method doesn't get it all. Again, maybe it doesn't have to.

Either way, great work on restoring a machine most would give up for dead! If you're having fun restoring it, imagine what riding it will be like!

I plan on using a wire wheel after the permatex cures for a week. I called a local paint shop for a quote on blasting the frame and they said they didn't have a blaster. The guy I spoke with told me using the rust treatment BEFORE wiring everything off is a good idea so you don't spread rust seeds to other areas. He said this with a disclaimer that he is by no means a chemist, but I figured it was worth a shot. If it is redundant than I don't mind wasting $8 on trying something new

Once it is all wire wheeled and all the rust I can get to is removed I will treat it again then do the final coat. I am going to take all the little parts to my work and use our blaster to clean them up and remove all the rust.

If it turns out my frame needs to be replaced I'm not worried. I'm in this for the long haul and will chop all losses to more experience. The learning process alone and discovery of the inner workings of these bikes is just too cool. Plus I see a pretty healthy rotation of various GL1000's for sale on craigslist.

I can't wait to ride it Taking the red 1977 out on the road is what sold me on getting one. Closer and closer!

[aaronrecine]

Hate to sound like a broken record but that center stand looks like it is rather far forward. One of the signs of the frame section being rusted is the center stand going way past where it should when it's down. Maybe someone else can confirm or deny? Just looks a bit too far in the pic.

.

I believe it maybe an optical illusion due to the lack of the engine. The forks are fully unloaded instead of having the pre-load of the engine and everything. I found the article in shoptalk identifying where cracks can occur and how the center stand can bend forward. I didn't see any cracks, but will double check again tomorrow. Thanks for pointing it out and I'd love to hear others assessment.

This is a snapshot of a video I took of my GL with most everything on it.


I am going to sadly have to agree with you. That the stand looks to have gone too far forward. I see the only real options are to weld in a new piece and eliminate the center stand, or get a new frame. Any other repair options?

[ericheath]

Pretty sure Robin is right on the center stand. In the above pic it looks as though the back tire is nearly touching the ground. In the pics you posted earlier, the usual places do look solid. So maybe look further down on the next piece of the support or where the pin is. Could be optical, but it could also be dangerous. At some point it will let go and if it’s the right side, it can easily go over on you. Happened to mine.

[aaronrecine]

Pretty sure Robin is right on the center stand. In the above pic it looks as though the back tire is nearly touching the ground. In the pics you posted earlier, the usual places do look solid. So maybe look further down on the next piece of the support or where the pin is. Could be optical, but it could also be dangerous. At some point it will let go and if it’s the right side, it can easily go over on you. Happened to mine.

It still has some rust to be removed, but it seems overall intact. When I bring my drill home and wire wheel it I will get a better idea.

Here are some more pictures of the area where I tried to capture the worst of it.

All your thoughts and feedback have been a tremendous help. I truly appreciate it.

[aaronrecine]

I started looking into the breakdown of Honda's part #s while determining what options I have for a used frame and found this article http://www.kaila.net/tl125/tl125partcod ... roductcode to try and find the differences through the years.

Here is an excerpt from that article...

"General parts have a part number divided into 3 sections, such as 22201-166-000 (clutch friction plate for the TL125).

The first string of digits (22201-XXX-XXX) indicates the Honda function and component number for this part. For example, there are several different part numbers for the TL clutch friction plate, all sharing funtion/component number 22201. Clutch steel plates have f/c code 22311, indicating same function but different component.

The second string of digits (XXXXX-166-XXX) is the product code, also known as Parts Classification Number in hondaspeak. This is the number that indicates the product (motorcycle) where this particular part was first used. See below for a complete listing of older Honda product codes. 166 indicates that the TL clutch friction plates where first used in Honda MB5 motorcycle. Honda often lists several different part numbers for the same part, indicating slight differences in the part, such as different supplier etc. For example there are four different part numbers listed for the clutch friction plates.
All TL125 models (1973 K, 1974 K1, 1975 K2 and 1976 S) share the product code 355. All General parts having a different product code are "recycled" from other Honda models. Only parts with code 355 were originally designed for the TL125, but may have been used in later Honda models. The product code is probably the most interesting portion of the part number when trying to determine interchangeability of Honda parts between various models.

The third string of digits (XXXXX-XXX-000) is the Classification Number. I believe it is mostly used to indicate various suppliers or improvements for the same part. Also any potential color code is tacked at the end of the classification number as digits (letters) 4 & 5."

Here is a list of all the various years of GL1000s and their part #'s I pulled from the Honda parts diagrams I have access to at work

1975 frame - 50100-371-670ZA

1976 ltd - 50100-371-980
1976 ltd - 50100-371-671ZA

1976 frame - 50100-371-671ZA

1977 frame - 50100-371-673ZA

1978 frame - 50100-431-671ZA
1978 frame - 50100-431-672ZA
1978 frame - 50100-431-770ZA
1978 frame - 50100-431-771ZA

1979 frame - 50100-431-770ZA
1979 frame - 50100-431-771ZA
1979 frame - 50100-431-771ZA

If I am understanding the article correctly...
50100<- This is the function / component # of all the frames from 1975-79. Since they all match I assume this means the frame is relatively the same throughout the different years.

371/431<- This is the Parts Classification # which indicates which motorcycle this part was first used on. Meaning the frames changed from 77 to 78 but, no changes from 75-77 and no changes from 78-79. Or maybe not since it only indicates a different model of motorcycle. Not sure..

980/670ZA/671ZA/672ZA/673ZA <- This is the supplier / revision # which is where it gets interesting...

980 - 1976 LTD Only
670ZA - 1975 Only
671ZA - 1976 LTD, 1976 & 1978 <- Very interesting
672ZA - 1978 Only
673ZA - 1977 Only
770ZA - 1978, 1979
770ZA - 1978, 1979

From what I can tell, all years should swap, but their might be some minor differences. From what i've read online on various forums is 1975 to 1979 frames are fully interchangeable. Before committing to a purchase of a frame which could possibly be useless to me, does anyone have accurate info on this?

[Track T 2411]

Basically, the 75-77 frames are the same, and 78-79 frames are the same. If you're just looking at a bare frame, stay within those years and everything should swap over. If you pick up a parts bike, there are numerous differences each year, like carbs, brakes, forks, etc., but most stuff will interchange one way or another.

[desertrefugee]

Agreed. I respect your attention to detail, but you're definitely overthinking it. TT summed it up nicely. Really doesn't have to be more exacting than that.

[TorontoGL]

very good point. I finished my bike and ready to ride, while removing side stand to soak in evaporus, noticed subframe was very badly rusted and had several rust holes, therefore bike stood on side stand really low, drop was more than normal. Luckily got a like new subframe and replaced it

[aaronrecine]

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