More on GL1000 ignition
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- mikenixon
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
Note the position of the flyweights when assembled. Because the Dyna rotor is thicker, the flyweights are partly deployed at rest.
Mike Nixon
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- ericheath
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
Seeing if I get this. This pic is stolen from one of Mike’s previous posts.
So what you’re saying is the increased thickness of the inner diameter of the slotted portion, causes the advance mechanism to be partly deployed?
It probably changes the rate of the advance at first as well.
And these are two areas you could remove material because on the other end, full advance rests here and is also limited? This of course changes it from going back to points if ever needed.
It’s too bad the optical C5 types aren’t a bit more affordable. Can’t beat them for accuracy and ease of installation, and on-the-fly adjustability.
So what you’re saying is the increased thickness of the inner diameter of the slotted portion, causes the advance mechanism to be partly deployed?
It probably changes the rate of the advance at first as well.
And these are two areas you could remove material because on the other end, full advance rests here and is also limited? This of course changes it from going back to points if ever needed.
It’s too bad the optical C5 types aren’t a bit more affordable. Can’t beat them for accuracy and ease of installation, and on-the-fly adjustability.
- ericheath
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
Easing the sharp edges of the slot in the rotor might also work and keep the advancer stock?
- CYBORG
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
I have a C5 system. And when you consider it also comes with a coil, wires, etc. it's not that more expensive, considering the performance gainsericheath wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:26 am Seeing if I get this. This pic is stolen from one of Mike’s previous posts.
So what you’re saying is the increased thickness of the inner diameter of the slotted portion, causes the advance mechanism to be partly deployed?
5C8D7F2C-DC37-46F5-89CB-A2F6EA41F0C5.jpeg
F7E5F4C7-5DF2-452E-A343-670A84CC12E1.jpeg
It probably changes the rate of the advance at first as well.
And these are two areas you could remove material because on the other end, full advance rests here and is also limited?
89C5CB00-BA3C-45D5-92FB-278F48041FB3.jpeg
This of course changes it from going back to points if ever needed.
It’s too bad the optical C5 types aren’t a bit more affordable. Can’t beat them for accuracy and ease of installation, and on-the-fly adjustability.
- mikenixon
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
What I do is thin the inner surface of the stop ears slightly, hmm, maybe 25%. That's all. Hmm, as for rate of the curve, that never occurred to me but I guess partial deployment also means partly stretched springs also, meaning the initial advance increase could be delayed. But I have always worked to the partial deployment thing, correcting that in order to get the full curve back.
By the way, even if you do the timing statically as I do, you can still use the static method to gauge how much to remove from the stops, if any is needed. Always check the timing at both idle and full advance before making any modifications. It is possible Dyna has different specs of thickness of the rotor. Anyway, you can check full advance timing statically by putting a stepped or cupped washer in place of the normal washer at the end of the advancer. This will temporarily keep the advancer at full advance. Or if your fingers are strong you don't need the washer.
By the way, even if you do the timing statically as I do, you can still use the static method to gauge how much to remove from the stops, if any is needed. Always check the timing at both idle and full advance before making any modifications. It is possible Dyna has different specs of thickness of the rotor. Anyway, you can check full advance timing statically by putting a stepped or cupped washer in place of the normal washer at the end of the advancer. This will temporarily keep the advancer at full advance. Or if your fingers are strong you don't need the washer.
Mike Nixon
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https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
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- mikenixon
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
I should add here that I am not proposing this modification to the Dyna setup as a fix for any particular or any possible running symptom. I see the timing overall as more a cause of issues than I do timing whose curve is shortened. In fact, look at my video of a well-tuned engine on my website. Careful setup of the ignition system (including but not limited to timing), cam belt adjustment, valves set at 0.006", and a cafeful, knowledgable carb rebuild are what went into making that result. By the way, that bike has a Dyna and it required much more work than it should have to time correctly. I assume all of you time your Dynas by watching for spark at a grounded plug and noting if it cooincides with the F mark?
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24[/Video]
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24[/Video]
Mike Nixon
www.motorcycleproject.com
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
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https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
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- dontwantapickle
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
I'm not totally sure what Mike is saying either.ericheath wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:26 am Seeing if I get this. This pic is stolen from one of Mike’s previous posts.
So what you’re saying is the increased thickness of the inner diameter of the slotted portion, causes the advance mechanism to be partly deployed?
5C8D7F2C-DC37-46F5-89CB-A2F6EA41F0C5.jpeg
As stated earlier, I measured stock and dyna rotors and the OD of all 3 measured Exactly the same at 18cm.
when installed on the cam. there is no difference in the location of the flyweights.
I see no indication of static timing being advanced at all.
I'd like to think that the engineers at Dyna would have the wearwithall to have taken size into account when designing their rotors, especially when it would affect something like the advance.
- mikenixon
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
Every Dyna S rotor made for a vintage Honda I have seen has been larger in diameter than the stock rotor. Maybe in recent years this has changed. Are yours aluminum?
Mike Nixon
www.motorcycleproject.com
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/lies_ether.html
www.motorcycleproject.com
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/lies_ether.html
- mikenixon
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
Whoa. That in my view is putting faith in aftermarjet parts designers that is woefully undeserved.dontwantapickle wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 12:42 pm I'd like to think that the engineers at Dyna would have the wearwithall to have taken size into account when designing their rotors, especially when it would affect something like the advance.
Mike Nixon
www.motorcycleproject.com
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/lies_ether.html
www.motorcycleproject.com
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/lies_ether.html
- dontwantapickle
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
maybe their QC has gotten better, I don't know, But.....
Dyna S aluminum rotor: Stock Honda rotor:
- Old Fogey
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
As far as I'm aware, the C5 system has not been available for some time.CYBORG wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:00 amI have a C5 system. And when you consider it also comes with a coil, wires, etc. it's not that more expensive, considering the performance gainsericheath wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:26 am Seeing if I get this. This pic is stolen from one of Mike’s previous posts.
So what you’re saying is the increased thickness of the inner diameter of the slotted portion, causes the advance mechanism to be partly deployed?
5C8D7F2C-DC37-46F5-89CB-A2F6EA41F0C5.jpeg
F7E5F4C7-5DF2-452E-A343-670A84CC12E1.jpeg
It probably changes the rate of the advance at first as well.
And these are two areas you could remove material because on the other end, full advance rests here and is also limited?
89C5CB00-BA3C-45D5-92FB-278F48041FB3.jpeg
This of course changes it from going back to points if ever needed.
It’s too bad the optical C5 types aren’t a bit more affordable. Can’t beat them for accuracy and ease of installation, and on-the-fly adjustability.
- mikenixon
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
Based on that, I'd say so.dontwantapickle wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:43 pmmaybe their QC has gotten better, I don't know, But.....
Dyna S aluminum rotor:
dyna rotors2.jpg
Stock Honda rotor:
dyna rotors3.jpg
Mike Nixon
www.motorcycleproject.com
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/lies_ether.html
www.motorcycleproject.com
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/ ... _carb.html
https://youtu.be/CDnzwDWhN24
https://www.motorcycleproject.com/text/lies_ether.html
- CYBORG
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
Old Fogey wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 5:02 pmAs far as I'm aware, the C5 system has not been available for some time.CYBORG wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:00 amI have a C5 system. And when you consider it also comes with a coil, wires, etc. it's not that more expensive, considering the performance gainsericheath wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:26 am Seeing if I get this. This pic is stolen from one of Mike’s previous posts.
So what you’re saying is the increased thickness of the inner diameter of the slotted portion, causes the advance mechanism to be partly deployed?
5C8D7F2C-DC37-46F5-89CB-A2F6EA41F0C5.jpeg
F7E5F4C7-5DF2-452E-A343-670A84CC12E1.jpeg
It probably changes the rate of the advance at first as well.
And these are two areas you could remove material because on the other end, full advance rests here and is also limited?
89C5CB00-BA3C-45D5-92FB-278F48041FB3.jpeg
This of course changes it from going back to points if ever needed.
It’s too bad the optical C5 types aren’t a bit more affordable. Can’t beat them for accuracy and ease of installation, and on-the-fly adjustability.
[/ quote]
No idea if it is still available. Only commenting on the value, compared to dyna systems
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
C5's are no longer produced.
- Sidecar Bob
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Re: More on GL1000 ignition
I like to think I have at least enough understanding of how points ignitions work to understand what my limitations regarding setting them up are. For me changing to a Dyna S meant that once it was set up properly I didn't need to worry about trying to remember how everything related to the result when the points needed attention and I hadn't thought about it for the last couple of years.
Based on the discussion in this thread I believe my Dyna's rotor didn't need to be modfied.If a Dyna, was the advancer modified to work properly with the magnetic rotor, were the two pickups synchronized
I tried "resistor plug wires" for a while but stopped using them long before I installed the Dyna Swere the fiberglass plug wires replaced with real wire
I had worked on the points enough times that setting one side and not the other wouldn't have felt right.were both sides of the ignition timed and not just one?
Perhaps, but if done right you only have to do it once.In my view, getting a Dyna to work correctly is more work than tuning the stock setup.
Well, twice in my case, but only because I kept the Dyna S when I changed engines.
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