Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

Post your "How To", or share tips and tricks about maintenance related to four cylinder Wings. Only registered users can read this forum.

Moderators: Whiskerfish, Forum Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
Old Fogey
Honored Life Member
Honored Life Member
Posts: 7759
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:31 pm
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Contact:

Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#1

Post by Old Fogey »

The post currently in Shop Talk that I did on the rocker shaft change-over was a bit, well, not so much misleading as inadequate. It caused a lot of head scratching, but in my defence I was a bit new to posting technical stuff and it's very easy to miss out important things when YOU know how but are not used to showing others.

So here's a new version. This time hopefully I'll get it a bit more understandable. Admin, feel free to change the old one in Shop Talk for this if you think it's better.

First off, let's understand why we are doing this.

Here is a pic of a very worn shaft:

Image

Due to the pressure from the valve springs and the cam, the rockers wear each of the shafts on the under side. Now, normally when a part is worn like this, the only recourse is to replace it. But here we are lucky. Because both the shafts are identical and because of the way the rockers are arranged, the shafts can be swopped one for the other so that the rockers will ride on fresh metal. You can see the arrangement here:

Image

I had a bit of a surprise with the head I was doing this on. One of a pair that came in a job lot of parts, in a disgusting mess.

Image


when I cleaned it down for the photos I found that someone had already done this modification! But done it wrong!

Image

Check out the oil holes in the shaft. These are supposed to point down to spray the camshaft lobes.

(I changed them round and removed the cam carrier for this pic so that you can see where they are supposed to be)

Image

OK, back to where we were.

Hopefully, if you have the heads off you removed them with the cam in such a position that the rockers were all nearly free ie. with all the cam lobes pointing in towards the head.
Back off the tappet adjusters until there is no spring pressure on any of the rockers.

Image

I like to disturb things as little as possible (although these heads will be getting totally stripped eventually due to their condition) but if you leave the cam carrier on the head after removing the six 12mm bolts, the shafts will only come out of the carrier towards the rear of the head. As these heads were already off I took off the pulley and rear timing case cover for the next step.
Further on I will show you how to do the next step on a head that is on a running engine, without taking anything else such as pulleys, covers, timing belts etc off.

Gently tap the shafts out of the cam carrier using a drift. They are not normally a tight fit so once you have them started you can usually pull them out the rest of the way by hand.

Image

Rockers and their springs will stay in place while you swap over the shafts

Image

Now you can see from this that simply moving the inlet shaft down to replace the exhaust shaft and vice versa will result in the oil holes pointing up as in the previous picture.

Image

So the shafts have to be turned end over end to rectify this.

Image

Lube up the shafts and slide each one back into place, replace the six bolts and torque them down evenly. I don't have torque figures for these bolts but about 12 ft/lbs should be enough

If you have done the job right it should look like this:

Image

All that remains now is to reset the tappets and fit the rocker cover back on.

To do this on a head that is still on the engine.

Follow the procedure as above but don't go removing cam belt, pulleys, covers, tack drive bolts or anything else.
Since there is nothing to get a hold on to pull the shafts out and you can't get to punch them from the front you need to use something with a right angle on it to get the shaft started. I simply used a pair of circlip pliers to give the shafts the initial push. Once they have moved out the back somewhat, you can get hold of them and pull them the rest of the way.

I mocked up the head as if it were still on an engine:

Image

Use your right angle implement (whatever) to get the shafts started:

Image
Image


No problem with getting them past the fuel pump/tach drive:

Image

So now proceed as above. You should be able to do each side from start to finish in 15 minutes unless you hit something unforseen.
"Impossible Is Just a Level of Difficulty!..."
If I'd wanted you to understand, I would have explained it better! (Johann Cruyff)
I’d give my right arm to be ambidextrous! :-D
User avatar
ericheath
Honored Life Member
Honored Life Member
Posts: 9597
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:20 am
Location: Winnipeg, Manituba

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#2

Post by ericheath »

Nice work again. We sure appreciate your input here. Hope to try this later this year.
Whatever I suggest here should be given ample time for a moderator to delicately correct. I apologize in advance.
77 WING, 1200 engine with 77 heads, cams, gl1100 foot pegs, Magna V65 front end, 764A carbs, [-gone Suzuki M109 monoshock--, replaced with gl1100 shocks] gl 1200 swing arm, gl1500 final drive, wheel and rear brakes Valkyrie seat, Meanstreak tank, Sportster pipes, Power Arc ignition off crank.
77 Wing. black
83 Wing, in pieces
"Continuing education is important even if the subject matter is fairly useless (as in this case)."---Greg Foresi
User avatar
robin1731
Membership Admin
Membership Admin
Posts: 21816
Joined: Mon May 29, 2006 8:31 am
Location: Decatur, Indiana

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#3

Post by robin1731 »

That shows it exactly. Now the guy that was all screwed up on the other thread knows more too. ;)

(that guy would be me) :roll:
1976 Goldwing Super Sport
1985 Honda Elite
1976 KZ900 Dragbike
1992 ZX7 Dragbike (KZ900 style motor w/NOS)
and a rotation of various purchases
Randakk approved Carb Rebuilder
User avatar
Whiskerfish
President
President
Posts: 37581
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2006 9:34 pm
My Album: http://www.ngwclub.com/gallery/v/wingmans/whiskerfish/
Location: Norfolk Va

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#4

Post by Whiskerfish »

Very good action1 action1 action1

Like to give this a day or two here and then move it. John if I forget give me a nudge in a couple days please.
"Agreement is not a requirement for Respect" CDR Michael Smith USN (Ret) 2017
"The book is wrong, this whole Conclusion is Fallacious" River Tam
"Yea I do dance awkwardly, and I am having more fun than you" Taylor Swift
2008 GL1800 IIIA "TH3DOG"
1984 GL1200 Standard
1975/6/7/8/9 Arthur Fulmer Dressed Road bike
1975 Naked Noisy and Nasty in town bike

Psst. oh and by the way CHANGE YOUR BELTS!!!!
User avatar
lcallison
Silver Member
Silver Member
Posts: 904
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:33 pm
Location: Rogers, AR

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#5

Post by lcallison »

Thank you for the excellent article. I'll be doing this on my 76 shortly. Maybe it'll be the fix for that noisy beast.
Larry
84 GL1200A
79 GL1000
User avatar
Sagebrush
Run Executive
Run Executive
Posts: 6537
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 10:35 pm
My Album: http://www.ngwclub.com/gallery/v/wingmans/album269/
Location: Raleigh, NC

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#6

Post by Sagebrush »

Good job John, even I can understand it action1
Dean Spalding
Raleigh, NC

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein

'82 Yellow GL1100
'81 Blue GL1100

My Gallery
My 1100 Build Thread
User avatar
rcmatt007
Treasurer
Treasurer
Posts: 31475
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2005 12:48 pm
My Album: http://www.ngwclub.com/gallery/v/wingmans/rcmatt007/
Location: New River Valley, Virginia

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#7

Post by rcmatt007 »

excellent how to! Good work
-Rodger-
all it takes for evil to prosper is the want of a few good men to do nothing-Edmund Burke
The question is not how much time do you have, it is what you do with the time that you have Gandalf
"One of the greatest dignities of humankind is that each successive generation is invested in the welfare of each new generation." Fred Rodgers
"it takes 10,000 hours to become an expert" ancient saying
78 constantly modified/customized since 1978, BOTM June 2015 de-evolving this very moment viewtopic.php?f=30&t=65511
76 Ltd "cookies bike" ALMOST DONE
79 project, finished, FOR SALE
'86 1200 (Beth's)(FOR SALE) with motorvation sidecar (sidecar sold) , July 2017 BOTM
'17 HD Road king and 08 HD Heritage softail (Beth's) (FOR SALE). I guess you can say we have MBS
User avatar
rogue1000
SUPER BIKER!!!!
SUPER BIKER!!!!
Posts: 3723
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:28 pm
Location: SLO, Ca.

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#8

Post by rogue1000 »

Excellent how to, John, thanks...The symtoms that would lead one to suspect he needed to do this fix would be excessive noise? Maybe coupled with high milage?
Brian Crow
1977 gl1000, with California sidecar
"KBO"!! Keep bungling on! Winston Churchill
"Bound is boatless man"
User avatar
Old Fogey
Honored Life Member
Honored Life Member
Posts: 7759
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:31 pm
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Contact:

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#9

Post by Old Fogey »

Just noise really Brian. The worse the wear the lower the oil pressure under the rockers as it can bleed out too fast, causing more wear. I guess in extreme cases the pressure throughout the engine would drop because of it since the oil will take the path of least resistance.

The the top end will get over oiled, the crank bearings will be starved......

The extra oil will carry the bits of metal worn off the shafts and the rockers down to jam the oil pump....

The shafts will break in two and the rockers will punch holes in the covers and in your legs.........aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Paranoid? Moi?
"Impossible Is Just a Level of Difficulty!..."
If I'd wanted you to understand, I would have explained it better! (Johann Cruyff)
I’d give my right arm to be ambidextrous! :-D
User avatar
05c50
Gold Member
Gold Member
Posts: 1380
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:05 pm
Location: Greensburg, Pa
Contact:

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#10

Post by 05c50 »

Very nice "how to", John. The pictures are excellent, and even with your accent, I could understand everthing you said. :lol: :lol: I was just wondering about the wear on the inside of the rockers. Have you ever seen rockers worn to point that they were unusable?

............Paul
I prefer to ride my wing naked,thank you
My wife asked me "How many bikes does one man need?" My answer "Uhhh.just one more"
75 Goldwing
78 Goldwing
77 CB750a
77 CB550f
80 CB650c
05 Boule C50
User avatar
Old Fogey
Honored Life Member
Honored Life Member
Posts: 7759
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:31 pm
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Contact:

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#11

Post by Old Fogey »

The simple answer to that is the only ones I've had that would not be used again are the ones in the article! Reason; they had already been turned and then used in an engine with severe oiling problems (the crank shells were worn though to the copper!).

The vast majority of these heads will never have had the shafts removed, so a quick turn around and you would be good to go for another 30 years!
"Impossible Is Just a Level of Difficulty!..."
If I'd wanted you to understand, I would have explained it better! (Johann Cruyff)
I’d give my right arm to be ambidextrous! :-D
User avatar
MSGT-R
Lady Winger
Lady Winger
Posts: 1021
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:53 pm
Location: CO

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#12

Post by MSGT-R »

Old Fogey wrote:The the top end will get over oiled, the crank bearings will be starved......

The extra oil will carry the bits of metal worn off the shafts and the rockers down to jam the oil pump....

The shafts will break in two and the rockers will punch holes in the covers and in your legs.........aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Paranoid? Moi?
Dude, we really must get you back on your meds! :happy_251:
81 Interstate: gone but never forgotten.
13 F6B
NGW Cartel
giant81
Titanium Member
Titanium Member
Posts: 342
Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 11:43 pm
Location: Montfort, WI

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#13

Post by giant81 »

MSGT-R wrote:
Old Fogey wrote:The the top end will get over oiled, the crank bearings will be starved......

The extra oil will carry the bits of metal worn off the shafts and the rockers down to jam the oil pump....

The shafts will break in two and the rockers will punch holes in the covers and in your legs.........aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Paranoid? Moi?
Dude, we really must get you back on your meds! :happy_251:

How do we know this isn't him on his meds? I wonder what he'd be like off of them.

Could this be something I might want to look at doing on my 81? I think the odo says about 65,000 miles on it and I'd suspect this hasn't been done. I've got time before my parts arrive. I suspect it wouldn't hurt to switch these around.
"The only way to earn bragging rights, is to do shit worth bragging about!!" -- ME
"Make it go before show, you can't drive pretty!" --My brother
"There is no such thing as reality, there is only perception." --unknown

R.I.P. 1981 GL1100 :(
riding in the meantime 2004 zx-10r (friends bike)
hoping to find, anything more comfortable than the rocket.
User avatar
Anim8or Earl
Chrome Member
Chrome Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:40 am
Location: New York, USA

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#14

Post by Anim8or Earl »

Thanks Old Fogey, that was very easy to follow.
jameswells
Brass Member
Brass Member
Posts: 32
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 8:34 am
Location: Barton on Humber

Re: Free Rocker Shaft Fix (new version)

#15

Post by jameswells »

Hi John

Would this be a good thing to do on any GL that's done 50,000 miles? Or only if it looks necessary after examining the parts? Is wear usually visible?
Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “How To 4-Wings (Tutorials Only)”